ACU Lectures Day 1
Wow! What a day it has been. I arrived in Abilene about 2 am ish. Long drive over from Tucson to here. Left Tucson about 12:30 after church, dropped the girls off and headed off toward taht citadel of higher education. Got pulled over for “speeding” on the east side of Colorado City about 12.30ish … but got off with a warning. Was glad of that! Got into bed around 2:30 got up at 7 and have been going all day long. I am whipped out.
I showed up to my class and it was full and for this I am glad. K. C. Moser’s daughter and my friend, Fran, graced us with her presence. I did my thing and then it was off to the races again. I visited with Jim Martin (my old professor) over a cup of java for quite some time. I visited with Jim Bevis of the old Campus Evangelism movement of the 1960s and Leroy Garett (another Church of Christ “heretic”). Ran into Sue and Kurt Burton and had a few laughs together. Met Tim Archer for the first time. Sat in my friend’s, Ed Robinson, class on Marshall Keeble. Went to hear Brian McLaren address the crowd at 3 pm. Went to the Center for Restoration Studies and looked up a few things for my class. I had dinner at Taco Bueno. Went to hear Kevin Murray’s keynote speech. Then headed over to a reception and visited with a number of friends. Shew …
In a few minutes I will look at my stuff for tomorrow and add a few pics and makes some revision for tomorrow … Oh I forgot I ran into Cecil Price too.
What a day it has been!!
Got to get up for the Restoration Quarterly breakfast at 6.45 … need sleep.
September 23rd, 2008 at 2:49 pm
Bobby,
I hope you have a great time.
You are always in my thoughts and prayers.
I know your class is going to be great.
Was wondering if you are going to have CD’s on your class?
September 23rd, 2008 at 3:16 pm
Sounds like a great time! A real re-charge. Just be sure to re-charge on sleep before you head back.
September 23rd, 2008 at 4:52 pm
Jealous. Jealous. Jealous.
It just wasn’t in the cards for me to get to go to Abilene this year. I really regret that I can’t be at your classes and some of the other good stuff there. But I will be listening in as I can.
The ACU lectures are really fine. But why did they go with “Summit”? A summit? In Abilene?
September 23rd, 2008 at 9:55 pm
Busy! Wish I could hear your classes. I would love to meet Leroy Garrett as he is one of my heroes.
September 23rd, 2008 at 10:19 pm
Gee, Frank, what’s wrong with calling it a “summit”? Everybody knows ACU is on “The Hill.”
September 24th, 2008 at 2:56 am
Sometimes people get away with teaching false doctrine because they have a lovely disposition. Furthermore, I understand that theologians have cast a circle which leaves old retired engineers out. Nevertheless, I have reviewed K.C.Moser’s definition of OBEY THE GOSPEL as to BELIEVE in the person. It didn’t fly back then and won’t fly now among we laity. I have posted one review.
http://www.piney.com/K.C.Moser.Gospel.Obeyed.html
September 24th, 2008 at 3:53 am
Have already heard good things about your presentation! Wish I was there.
Bill Williams
September 24th, 2008 at 4:31 am
Greetings. I learned today that my classes are among those that are being cast live from the school … so that was a bit nerve wracking today.
Ken,
I did not know you read my blog. I have visited piney on a few occasions and have found it to be literally colorful. I am glad you are here. Your review of Moser, you are not shocked to learn, that I disagree with … and usually find simply following your train of thought to be difficult.
Bill,
Glad you are hearing good things rather than bad ones, 😉
September 24th, 2008 at 2:10 pm
Actually, the first time we met, I actually got to stay and hear your class (on Huldah). Sorry I couldn’t stay this time. Ironically, now that I live in Abilene, it’s harder to actually attend lectures.
Grace and peace,
Tim
September 24th, 2008 at 3:37 pm
Did you discover that Huldah was a “Librarian” and not a “prophet” guided by the Spirit of Christ? Sure, when the top guns forget, you return to the librarian who safeguards the mishneh.
Ken Sublett
September 24th, 2008 at 4:14 pm
Ken,
Are you suggesting that Huldah was not a prophet, but a librarian? Maybe I misunderstood the intent of your post. 2 Kings 22:14 and 2 Chronicles 34:22 say Huldah was a prophet.
-Keith
September 24th, 2008 at 4:54 pm
They went to Huldah at the “college” which meant that they sought the “stored” text rather than trust the one they found in the “house of the Lord.” I think that constitutes a “patternism.”
The “college” was:
“4932. mishneh, mish-neh´; from 8138; properly, a repetition, i.e. a duplicate (copy of a document),”
She may have been the only person around who could tell the king what the Bible said and warn him. She in effect “taught” but she never did a proclamation in ‘church’ because the Qahal, synagogue or church in the wilderness was inclusive of REST, reading and rehearsing the Word of God. It was exclusive of “vocal or instrumental rejoicing.” (Nu 10 commented on by both Luther and Calvin).
Acts 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
That’s what Paul commanded in Romans 15 where “self-pleasure” was excluded so they could speak “that which was written” using one mind and one mouth.
That did not change until “preaching” other than reading and explaining as well as singing as an ACT was adopted in abut 373 “because they were common to all pagan cults.”
That which limits women also limits men. I have collected some notes on Huldah.
http://www.piney.com/Huldah.html
Probably hard to read because of too much Scripture 😉
September 24th, 2008 at 5:32 pm
Ken,
I don’t think you really answered my question. I’m guessing it’s because you don’t want to say that Huldah was a prophet. Please correct me if I am misrepresenting you.
I don’t see Huldah providing any “stored texts” to the king’s men. Rather, she validates that this book is indeed the Book of the Law, she interprets it for them (and for the King), then provides a specific message from God to King Josiah. If she’s a librarian, she is QUITE a librarian. I think calling her a prophet better summarizes her actions here and do the writers of Kings and Chronicles.
When the king said, “Go enquire of the Lord” his men went straight to Huldah.
September 24th, 2008 at 8:49 pm
And Hilkiah the high priest said unto Shaphan the scribe, I have found the book of the law in the house of the Lord. And Hilkiah gave the book to Shaphan, and he read it. 2Ki 22:8
The king obviously knew nothing about this “strange book.” He didn’t need a female preacher in the Church of Christ, or a musical worship mistress. He wanted to know about the WORDS OF THIS BOOK. They went to Huldah for two reasons: First, if she was a PROPHET rather than a “prophetess” she could tell him what he wanted to know. Rather, he wanted to know of THIS BOOK. Therefore, they went to Huldah
She validated that this was “the book” and may have been that written by Moses which was hidden away in the “college.” She dwelled in the:
4932. mishneh, mish-neh´; from 8138; properly, a repetition, i.e. a duplicate (copy of a document), or a double (in amount); by implication, a second (in order, rank, age, quality or location):—college, copy, double, fatlings, next, second (order), twice as much.
A “prophet” is also a teacher: whether supernaturally or not she gave the king encouragement.
She was not one of the “former prophets” who are validated as those who spoke by the Spirit of Christ in opposition to the pagan “prophesiers” who worked themselves with dancing and music and claimed that their gibberish was a message from the gods–they made their living by pretending to be prophetesses: Ezekial indicates that they attended “workshops” to steal their words one from another and then sold them as from God: does that ring a bell?
She may have conducted a school in some rabinnic view: if so then good for her. However, no prophet, speaker, singer or instrument player conld come near the holy things without getting killed. They were OUTSIDE where the surrogate lambs were slaughtered and the noise is never called music: like all pagan sacrifices it was “exorcism.” Musical Worship Teams 😉 claim that they can lead you into the presence of God and therefore claim to fill the Role of Jesus as the only mediator or intercessor.
The Holy Place was a type of the synagogue, body or church of Christ: any speaker, singer or instrument player who entered “church” would be instantly executed.
The bible still lays it down like concrete that women (and most men) are to be silent meaning sedentary because THEY were always the ones most likely to fall into the charismatic or musical “body worship.” The literature is NOT kind to any male who would fall into singing and playing an instrument. Nor are rhetoricians treated kindly because he is at the top of the list defined by hypocrites: second on the list is singers because all “singing” concepts spoke of enchantment or sorcery.
It may seem confusing but I have just posted some Bible in context on the passages assigned at the SUMMIT (Olympus 😉 ) and used to support Moser. I don’t charge so no requirement to affirm.
http://www.piney.com/K.C.Moser.1.html
I am certain that you can be at the summit without ever having read Paul in context or looked where Paul pointed.
September 24th, 2008 at 11:26 pm
Ken, you’re funny. It’s amazing how many times you’ve mentioned musical instruments when it’s not even in the scope of the discussion.
I do find your Librarian Hypothesis creative and entertaining. Unfortunately, the facts just don’t support it. You’ve attempted to redefine words and history to support your position. You might be better off searching for the facts then adjusting you position instead of the other way around.
Please take my criticism with a grain of salt, as I find myself doing the same thing sometimes. Perhaps we all do. Therefore, a message to us all:
Dude, you can’t just make stuff up.